EVO owners!! Is the MR worth it??

[Marq97GSX]

Evo dudes,

I am in the market for an evo. I just saw one here on base today for sale, its a 2006 evo 9 MR for $24K. Great miles, very clean. I can go look for a gsr evo 9 (I want an evo 9) and pay several thousands less), but my question is....is the MR really worth it? What would I really be missing out on if I don't get an MR? :dunno:

Thanks.

[cAPSlOCK97gst]

I don't know a whole lot about EVOs, but I know the 6-speed in the MR can't handle much power compared to the 5-speed in the GSR, SE, and RS.

[cAPSlOCK97gst]

GSR -5-speed, standard model
RS - rallisport, 5-speed, aluminum roof, gauge pack, minimal interior
SE - Special Edition, 5-speed, aluminum roof/hood, and front fenders, split seven-spoke forged aluminum BBS wheels in "diamond black" finish, HID headlights with integrated fog lights, red-stitched Recaro seats
MR - 6-speed, Bilstein monotube shocks, split seven-spoke forged aluminum BBS wheels, aluminum roof, hood, and front fenders, gauge pack, HID headlights with integrated fog lights, vortex generator, and custom MR badging.

[4g64fiero]

I'd buy the lowest model evo personally because I know I'm gonna replace all the good stuff that comes with the mr anyways.

They make carbon fiber roofs for the evo, I dont know about the fenders.

[FunWheelDrive]

Id want an RS.

[Marq97GSX]

That's what I thought...no disrespect to you guys, but I would also like to hear from current evo owners too. Although what you guys say makes tons of sense. I can get an evo 9 gsr for $20K. Yes, as fiero said, I'm gonna replace stuff in it anyways. Plus, grabbing a gsr I would throw on the vortex generator anyways.

[gSx-LeX]

I know many MR owners who regret getting them over the regular GSR model.

[gdmbat85]

I personally hate 6-speed transmissions. For that reason, I wouldn't get the MR. I also heard that the MR has a slightly larger turbo. I don't know if this applies to the 8 or 9, or if it's even true, but it's something you might want to find an answer to.

[Marq97GSX]

I'm now looking at a 2006 evo 9 SE. Does anyone have one/know someone with one?

[talon167]

I didn't think so when I bought my 'regular' VIII.

[NY 95 TSI AWD]

I'm now looking at a 2006 evo 9 SE. Does anyone have one/know someone with one?

There's one for sale on my local craigslist. It's 27,000 though. 16,000 miles. I don't know the guy, just browsing a few days ago to see what they had.

[bsmart82]

I would say it is not really worth it, but I like mine.

[cAPSlOCK97gst]

I also heard that the MR has a slightly larger turbo. I don't know if this applies to the 8 or 9, or if it's even true, but it's something you might want to find an answer to.

All Evos have the same turbos in each generation (all EVO VIIIs have 16Gs, all EVO IXs have 20Gs).

[bsmart82]

All Evos have the same turbos in each generation (all EVO VIIIs have 16Gs, all EVO IXs have 20Gs).

The 9's still use a 16g.

[talon167]

All Evos have the same turbos in each generation (all EVO VIIIs have 16Gs, all EVO IXs have 20Gs).

Well, the 05+ came with a bigger hotside (10.5 vs 9.8), and the IX is still a 16g.

[cs82685]

I knew a IX MR owner who swapped the 6spd for the 5 spd, replaced the suspension and replaced the wheels. Soooo, he paid 4K more for an aluminum roof a vortex generator and some badges?

[Infinity]

Man... a lot of MR Hating going on.

From what I understand, Aisin took the 5 spd case and internals that Mitsubishi had already built and added an extra gear to it besides changing around the ratios a bit. So it's not much different from the 5 but unfortunately there is less fluid in the 6 than there is in the 5 (2.1 quarts vs 2.5 quarts I think). It's not that it can't handle the power, it just over-heats a bit faster than the 5 due to less fluid and when I say overheats, I mean beating the shit out of the transmission around an Auto-X. So as the transmission overheats, it doesn't quite work as well and when you still demand H4RDC0R3!!!!1 performance out of it, it breaks.
I have never heard of a 6 spd failing otherwise, even if you're driving like a douche on the road. Oh there is one other problem with 6spd, it seems to require a proprietary fluid to work optimally: Mitsubishi's Super DiaQueen which is fucking expensive.
So as you can see, it really doesn't have the over-exaggerated flaws that most of the douche nozzles are running their mouth about. Get an bigger external cooler.

I personally prefer the 6 to the 5 because of the shorter ratios and better cruising ability in 6th on the highway.

Moving onto the suspension. "My buddy, he swapped out his suspension, so it's worthless anyway"
Well you go upgrade your suspension and complete fuck up the handling that Mitsubishi has done years of research to perfect, whilst I'll stick with my Bilsteins which are more comfortable to daily drive around and outperform stock GSR/RS suspension around the track, thank you very much.
I think SportsCompactCar did a test once ages ago on an 03 Evo 8 where the upgraded the springs and struts to some well known brands, Tokico or Tein I forget which, well anyway lo and behold, the car actually performed worse around the track with the new suspension than it did when it was stock. Hmm...

Anyway, the added features of the MR besides the transmission, suspension and roof include a slightly different front aerodynamics package which has a slightly different air dam with a chin spoiler, vortex generator, rear wing lip extension, the wheels as someone already pointed out, brake cooling guides, you also get a Boost, Oil Temp and Voltage gauges as standard and I believe the MR's have different tail-lights.

[UnsafeAtAnySpd]

This might not matter to many, but maybe to you. Another thing to consider is exclusivity. I don't mean in the sense of "I'm better than you because I have a MR" but more that you have a rarer car.

[Marq97GSX]

Got it. I'm going to go look at the 06 evo9 SE today.

[Spoolin69]

Copied from evolutionm.net

Beginners Read Me: New To Your Evo Or Looking For An Evo?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

MODS PLEASE MAKE THIS A STICKY. MOST OF US ARE GETTING TIRED OF READING ABOUT THE SAME BASIC EVO QUESTIONS. THIS SHOULD ANSWER MOST OF THEM.

I posted this on evotuners.net last year and decided it would be useful here too. Hope it helps!

ALL INFORMATION IN THIS THREAD IS RELEVANT TO THE USDM EVOS ONLY!

Hello everyone. Evo newbies can come on here and will know where to look for good basic information and less of the same questions will be asked. Make this a sticky so it will be at the top of the list and readily available. Personally I think the title of this thread will draw in more of the newer tuners.

(Remember wisemen make any corrections necessary and feel free to add info)

DIFFERENCES BETWEEN MODEL YEARS:
'03 AND '04 models- 271hp 273tq
Intercooler sprayer
RS model available in '04 (Front LSD, aluminum roof, no ABS, no power features)

'05 models - 276hp 286tq
Active Center Differential (ACD) on all models
Front LSD on all models
Intercooler sprayer no longer available
10.5 hotside on turbocharger
MR model now available (aluminum roof, Bilstein Shocks, 17.74lb BBS charcoal grey multispoke rims, 6spd trans, vortex generators)
RS still available
Sun, Sound, Leather (SSL) model of base VIII available (subwoofer, power sunroof, leather seats, HIDs)
No HIDs on base VIII

'06 models - 286hp 289tq
ACD still available
MIVEC has been added (variable valve timing)
Lighter Valve Cover
Added larger compressor housing to same 16g turbo from 05
Revised coolant passages in the head allowing for more boost/timing on pump gas
Last model year to use the 4g63 engine
SE models available as late year 06s (known as Evo 9.5s)
Hollow camshafts

WHAT TO LOOK FOR WHEN BUYING A USED EVO:
I just recently went through this so the experience is fresh in my mind. The first thing you should do is figure out which year you would like. The '03 is definately the cheapest so if money is an issue, you can start there. Next, if possible find the car with the accessories you would like with the lowest mileage possible. Obviously thats a given. Once you find a car to look at, look real closely at everything. Remember you would like to find one as stock as possible. Look at the radiator fins. Are they slightly bent; does it looks like someone has been playing around in there, maybe changing turbos and putting the stock one back on? Is the stock intake solid, or does it feel loose like it has been put on and off a few times? Check the oil, does it look fresh or is it low and black looking. How do the tires look? New tires especially for this car can be expensive and they are one of the key elements to how this car performs. How does the transmission shift? Naturally the tranny is a bit notchy but you can till what its supposed to feel like. How does the outside of the car look? If it has been neglected, most likely the rest of the car has been too. When driving the car, slam on the brakes. Does the wheel pulsate like the rotors are warped, or is it a smooth stop? And finally, one of the best things you can do. Take down the vin number and call Mitsubishi. Ask them what kind of warranty repairs have been made. One of the cars I looked at had about 6 different $800 to $3000 repairs all on different items on the car. That right there tells you one thing. The car has been driven hard and you dont want it. Also get a carfax report. Most dealerships (if thats where the car is) give a free one. If you have to buy one, its worth the money. Be very thorough and remember that you are spending a good amount of money here. Take your time. If something doesn't look right, ask about it. Good luck, and don't rush a purchase, its worth waiting a little while longer for a nice one.

WHERE YOU SHOULD BEGIN:
Congratulations on picking an evo. These cars have tons of potential and are relatively easier to modify versus some of the other similar performing cars out there. The first thing you need to do is understand your car. Get a feel for how the car is supposed to act before even thinking about modifying it. Be sure the car runs properly and all maintenance has been completed. If the car has over 20,000 to 30,000 miles on it, be sure to change all fluids also (brake, differential, transmission, transfer case just to name a few) and the spark plugs should be replaced also. Also keep in mind if you give a damn about the warranty. If so you can still lightly modify the car to the point where most of the stuff can be undone should you need to bring the car in for a warranty repair.

YOUR FIRST MODS:
After you have learned a little about how to handle the car and all of the maintenance has been done, you are ready for a little tweaking. Before you go thinking about shiney blow off valves and big exhaust tips, ask yourself what your goals are. If you only want a mid 12 second car, chances are you wont need to replace your blow off valve or your stock intercooler. Don't spend extra money if you don't have to. Do some research and find out what you need to reach your goal. Remember this site and most evotuners are interested in performance; isn't that why you decided to buy this car? A good place to start is to invest in mods that provide you with information. A boost gauge and data logger is crucial. Learn how the car acts when it is stock and what readings are normal for your car. This will help if you get stumped later on down the road. Then slowly work your way closer to your goal. There is no need to rush and don't try to reach your goal all at once. The more time and thought you put into mods, the less money you'll spend in the long run and you have a better chance at doing things right the first time.

HOW TO ASK QUESTIONS HERE AT EVOTUNERS:
This may seem silly but the majority of new tuners that ask questions do not ask the right questions. Search for your answer and put some time into it. Hopefully the majority of your questions will be answered here. Never "bench race." What I mean by that is trying to estimate how much power your car is making or what cars you can beat by saying what mods you have. There is simply no way of knowing unless you go out and do it first hand. Don't ask us if you can beat a corvette if you have intake and exhaust for example.

BASIC INFORMATION (Moderators and wisemen please answer these basic questions)

What engine does my car have?
All currently produced American market evo's have the 2.0 liter 4g63 turbo motor.

How much boost is my car running stock?It depends on the year:
03-04s run 19.5psi at 3500rpm, which tapers to 16psi by 6500rpm
05-06s run 20.3psi at 3500rpm, which tapers to 17psi by 6500rpm

How big is my stock turbo?
Evo's come with different variations of the 16g turbocharger:
03-04 = 16g6 with a 9.8cm^2 turbine housing
05 = 16g6 with a 10.5cm^2 turbine housing
06 = 16g6 with a 10.5cm^2 turbine housing and larger compressor housing

What is stock fuel pressure?
43psi with the vacuun hose off and plugged.

How much does fuel pressure increase when I am boosting?
1:1 = 1psi per 1psi

What size are the stock fuel injectors?
560cc

How big is the stock fuel pump?
03-05 = Same size as a Walbro GSS342, and flows 160lph@12v
http://www.roadraceengineering.com/f...pflowrates.htm
06 = Believed to be bigger than the 03-05s, but I don't know the actual flow rate (<-Warrtalon)

What is the max boost on pump gas I can run?
The best answer to this is that there is no answer, and it's frankly not a good question, though it's often asked. Octane is definitely the main determining factor for how much boost you can run, but there are still many other factors, such as the mods you have, the turbo you have (differs between years)

What will void my warranty?
Just about anything you do to the car that is not stock. Some people have reported that Mitsu voided their warranty when they changed to aftermarket rims (Mitsu claims that the aftermarket rims affect the drivetrain and hence the engine since the drivetrain is connected to the engine). Even something as simple as a grounding kit, aftermarket brake pads, or a catback exhaust may see your warranty voided. The sensitivity apparently varies from dealer to dealer, but generally speaking, there is a reason why so many are referred to as 'stealerships' who are ill-informed / ignorant of Evo mechanicals and use any reason to void your warranty.

The Magnusson-Moss Warranty Act was written to combat such practices, but since it requires you to hire a lawyer and pursue this in court with Mitsu over many months of fighting, most people don't even bother. It's worth it to at least mention the MMWA and have a copy of it in case you get denied warranty coverage, but don't expect them to honor it.

What kind of oil and weight do I use?
Look on your oil cap. The factory recommends Mobil One synthetic oil, 10w 30.

What fluid do I use in my transmission, transfer case and rear differential? How often do I change them?
OEM fluids only if you want to be safe. Many have tried aftermarket fluids only to come full circle back to the OEM fluids. Super DiaQueen for the transmission, DiaQueen LSD Oil for the transfer case and rear diff, and ATF III fluid for the ACD. All can be purchased at Mitsu or through Mitsubishiparts.net.

How much boost can my stock blow off valve hold? When do I need to upgrade?
03-05 = Efficient to 13psi, but the turbo runs 19-20psi stock, so the BOV still works, but it's not optimum. It's a good idea to upgrade to a PROPER RECIRCULATING BOV (actually called a DV = diverter valve) as soon as you up the boost. It is considered a stage 1 mod on 03-05 USDM Evos
06 = Efficient to 24-25psi. No need to upgrade until running more than 25psi (requires race gas or alky injection) on the stock turbo or until you upgrade the turbo.

What is an ecu flash? How do I get it?
In the old days where tuners did not have direct access to the factory ECU, the only ways to tune the ECU was by using a standalone ECU, a piggyback, or a series of devices that would fool the ECU by modifying variables such as AF, boost, etc. These days, with software such as ECUFlash (www.openecu.org), tuners can directly access the factory ECU and make changes that influence the performance of the car. ECUTek is another example of an ECU Flash tool. Custom tuning can be done for optimal gains, and mail-in flashes are available where mods are fairly simple (intake, TBE, etc). Al from Dynoflash and Jestr (John) of Jestr Tuning are tuners who are well known on various Evo boards who are familiar with ECU tuning. A Tactrix cable (www.tactrix.com) is required to connect software such as EvoScan (datalogger), ScanTech Generic OBD-II reader, and ECUFlash. It is basically a USB cable that connects to your car's OBD-II port.

EcuFlash Setup Instructions and Tutorial

When do I need to get an ecu flash?
You don't need a flash for EVERY mod, but you do need one for each mod that affects fuel or affects AFRs/timing.

Where is my ecu located?
The ECU is behind the glove box. It's very easy to get to and very easy to remove.

Does anyone use EGT (exhaust gas temperature) gauges anymore?
Not as much. You see more newbies getting them just to fill out their cool new 3-gauge cluster than you do more experienced Evo owners/racers who rely more on their wideband o2, timing, and knock readings.

How much does my evo weigh?(These are of course approximations, but give or take, this is about it)
RS - 3217
GSR - 3263
MR - 3285
GSR w/ssl - 3338

-Tyler Van Donge

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Last edited by 98autogstspyder; Jan 6, 2008 at 03:43

[Marq97GSX]

Thank you for the 'esplanation.' Helps me fine tune exactly what I am going to search for in an evo.

[Loner]

Wow that had a lot of information, that was usefull.

[Spoolin69]

Not a problem, That is the very information that I used to end my search for an EVO! That information is from evolutionm.net. I would like to thank them for all the help and great reads that they have!

-Shane

[Spoolin69]

All Evos have the same turbos in each generation (all EVO VIIIs have 16Gs, all EVO IXs have 20Gs).

Wrong! Please don't misinform people, I'm sure it was an honist mistake. Here is the rundown:

Evo's come with different variations of the 16g turbocharger:
03-04 = 16g6 with a 9.8cm^2 turbine housing
05 = 16g6 with a 10.5cm^2 turbine housing
06 = 16g6 with a 10.5cm^2 turbine housing and larger compressor housing

[lost spyder]

Evo 6speeds absolutely blow. Not only do they hold less fluid causing faster overheating but the gearset themselves are smaller to make room. Their other issue that a lot of people don't know about is their 6speed synchro problem. It's almost as notorious as crankwalk with 7 bolts.

The 6th gear synchronizer loves to fail and we're talking stock power levels. I hear nothing but moaning and bitching about swapping to a 5 speed from a buddy of mine who can never ever get into 6th unless he is above 6.5k rpms and jams it in there. Otherwise if he tried to go to 6 for a nice cruise on the highway forget it. It's as if it's not there.

He made me an offer for us to swap + cash but i was like nooo way. So now he's shooting for the 6 speed record et. he said if it blows before that then screw it. He ran 11.6 last year on a stock block/head and on a relatively small setup. We'll see what he can do with his new found freshness.

[Don Boosted]

How fast was he going at 6500 in 5th?

[4g64fiero]

Moving onto the suspension. "My buddy, he swapped out his suspension, so it's worthless anyway"

Super. I guess noone should bother upgrade the suspension on their evo mrs. :rolleyes:

[cAPSlOCK97gst]

Wrong! Please don't misinform people, I'm sure it was an honist mistake. Here is the rundown:

Evo's come with different variations of the 16g turbocharger:
03-04 = 16g6 with a 9.8cm^2 turbine housing
05 = 16g6 with a 10.5cm^2 turbine housing
06 = 16g6 with a 10.5cm^2 turbine housing and larger compressor housing

My bad, I heard that they had 20Gs but obviously I was wrong...:bash:...I knew for sure that they had larger turbos.

[skold]

mrs are junk, the trans is weak, evo 9 trans are weak peroid, you mr's weight alot too. i have an 04 RS EVO which is a base model. no ACD, no power windows, or locks. I quess it depends on what.

[UnsafeAtAnySpd]

mrs are junk, the trans is weak, evo 9 trans are weak peroid, you mr's weight alot too. i have an 04 RS EVO which is a base model. no ACD, no power windows, or locks. I quess it depends on what.

Sweet first post...

[UnsafeAtAnySpd]

How fast was he going at 6500 in 5th?

I'm guessing it has something to do with that peddle way over on the left. :)

[cs82685]

How fast was he going at 6500 in 5th?

he never said he had to be in 5th? neutral, perhaps another gear besides fifth and then shifting into 6th maybe ;)

Super. I guess noone should bother upgrade the suspension on their evo mrs. :rolleyes:

I don't think he was saying that, although he is correct in that it's very easy to fuck up an evos handling if you don't do your research. Regardless, if you are in the market for an evo and plan on modding the suspension it does seem silly to pay more for parts that you are just going to replace.

[Marq97GSX]

Regardless, if you are in the market for an evo and plan on modding the suspension it does seem silly to pay more for parts that you are just going to replace.


Yes. More sense. Why buy an evo 9 mr if I would be planning to throw my own suspension, swap turbo, and throw my own gauges? I do think the MRs are evo bling and very nice. But from what i've been reading on several evo websites, getting an evo mr would be for someone not planning to really track the car at all.

[lost spyder]

How fast was he going at 6500 in 5th?
Far too fast for the road and traffic we we're in:o. And he wears track pads/2 piece rotors everywhere so he always hits the brake last second to get as little squeal as possible. It's reallllllllly annoying for a daily driver. And people around town have learned to keep a safe following distance of 300feet around town behind him. He just doesn't care. He probably wishes someone rear ended his car so he could get a 5 speed and such.

[Module Unknown]

I'm now looking at a 2006 evo 9 SE. Does anyone have one/know someone with one?

I have a TB '06 IX SE, love it! Something you want to know about it?

[Asmodeus]

I have a TB '06 IX SE, love it! Something you want to know about it?

That is the holy grail of Evo's if you don't want an RS IMO. IX SE. All the goodies, none of the 6 speed. Newest 4G63 equipped badass mother fucker you can get your hands on.

I can't see you disagreeing...
:dunno:

[lost spyder]

I agree, thats the way to go without the 6 speed drawbacks. However i'm biased towards 8's. For some reason i just like the VIII's front better. Not to mention the factory wheels. How about those 06 ix rs's? I heard only 3XX something were made.

[Marq97GSX]

I have a TB '06 IX SE, love it! Something you want to know about it?


They have a 2006 evo9 GG SE at the nearest dealership from my house. Debating. It several thousand more than a WW 2005 evo 8 gsr I was also looking at. Is the SE that much lighter that it makes a difference?

[Asmodeus]

It's probably heavier. They both have ACD - the SE has the unique lip. And some options unique to it. Kind of... It's also a IX, not an VIII and will have the nicer IX interior. As well as MIVEC. Making it respond better to mods right off the gate. It's not a car I would buy if I was going to put a huge turbo on and drag etc. But if you want a car that starts out head and shoulders above the rest from step 1. Plus does it with some amenities... that's the car to buy.

[Spoolin69]

I'm a fan of my IX!! I still have a chubby!! I don't think it is going to go awayany time soon!!
http://i156.photobucket.com/albums/t40/Spoolin69/3495395_43.jpg


YUMMO!!

[95EagleAWD]

I'll enjoy my MR with the power windows, 6-speed on the highway and not really being that heavy to begin with.

That said, if I wasn't driving it daily, I would have gone for an RS.

[boosted92dsm]

Super. I guess noone should bother upgrade the suspension on their evo mrs. :rolleyes:

Not necessarily, you shouldn't touch the suspension unless you KNOW how to properly set it up.

[KJS1820]

We have had a few customers at the mitsu dealer I work at blow the 6 speeds and mitsu doesn't just sell a gear or two! They make you buy a whole cluster and last time I looked was around 2k :( The 5 speeds seem less prone to break but they had some shifting/grinding issues in the 03/04s! One of these years I may get a evo and won't be a MR unless it was REALLY cheap ;)

[cs82685]

I'll enjoy my MR with the power windows, 6-speed on the highway and not really being that heavy to begin with.

That said, if I wasn't driving it daily, I would have gone for an RS.

My GSR has power windows too :P

[ThaWhip]

My buddy wants to get rid of his 2004 evo for $15k. < 60k miles.

[my4g63gst]

I have an 03 Evo 8 I bought for 22,500 with 32,000 miles. Its not an MR and I dont want an MR. Only difference is a slightly bigger hotside to your turbo and a 6 speed transmission. I use to sell Evo's and driven both. The six speed's gears are VERY close and if your shifting fast you can end up in the wrong gear easier. I would go with a base Evo8. You can always goto a 10.5 hotside and if you want the looks of an MR, buy the trim used on ebay and swap out the seats. You will have the same kind of car, same power, but save a lot of money.

[bzerkkiller]

of course it all depends on the owner...what he prefers to have and what the goals for the car are. the RS, GSR, and MRs have their pros and cons