Who runs slicks with their FWD?

[WhoaTed]

I know this question has a pretty limited audience but...

I was just wondering if 1.8's are the best 60 foot times with slicks you can expect. I know Gary Marsh pulled a 1.6 last year, but no one else has done better than a 1.8 on the posted runs.

I am talking a relatively light 2G pushing about 300 to 350 hp. Any hope for better than 1.8's with this set-up?

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http://www.dsmtalk.com/images/forumgallery/burnout.gif Ted - 95 GSX
12.48@109.68 MPH

[Quadcylla]

I just got Toyo Proxy DRs but I don't know yet what 60 fts they'll get. I'll let ya know after Sept 17th.

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http://geocities.com/r337m0nk3y/dvv/asthanos.gif Quadcylla
92 Laser RS-T FWD

[WhoaTed]

I'm interested in how you do with the drag radials, post here... but I am looking for someone with slicks.

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http://www.dsmtalk.com/images/forumgallery/burnout.gif Ted - 95 GSX
12.48@109.68 MPH

[joec]

From the http://www.times.dsm.org site it looks like only 2 fwd's have done better than 1.8's. Marsh in the 1.6's and Hahn's turbo'ed RS in the 1.7's. I'm guessing the turbo'ed RS is lighter than a GS-T and he's making a s-load of power (122 mph!!).

Sounds like it'd be tough to break FWD 1.8's without LOTS of power or a serious weight loss. Maybe run wheelie bars? I think one of the 46G3 Colts/Mirages is doing well running some sort of removeable wheelie bars...

[WhoaTed]

Yeah I overlooked Hahn's...

You are right, Wheelie bars are getting more popular on the FWDs. Last week @ ETown I saw a FWD Sentra run 10.4 and 10.3 with slicks and a wheelie bar. Don't know what his 60's were though. :(

BTW that Sentra had a *slightly* bored block and a stock head :)

[Mick]

My best 60' with slicks is 1.908 babying the clutch. After watching some video tapes of my launches, I can see that 1.8's shouldn't be too hard to do. Bettering 1.8's might be another story. I just don't want to be that hard on my wimpy CFDF 2500 clutch, and I don't have any suspension mods to plant the front end, and keep it planted.

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'97 GST 12.85@109.2
NJDSM Club

[This message has been edited by Mick (edited August 24, 2000).]

[GSToy]

One of our members with a 97 GS-T ran with slicks about month ago.

Check it out http://www.notabusinessracing.org/ubb/Forum1/HTML/000069.html

[WhoaTed]

<BLOCKQUOTE><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial">quote:</font><HR>After watching some video tapes of my launches, I can see that 1.8's shouldn't be too hard to do. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>What was it in the video that you could see you were doing wrong?

I assume you mean you were just launching too soft.

How long you heat those babies up? A little blip or a major smokeshow?

Are you running stock drive train? Both you wheels smoke evenly?

What kind of tire pressure do you run in the slicks and what type of tire do you have on the rear?

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http://www.dsmtalk.com/images/forumgallery/burnout.gif Ted - 95 GSX
12.48@109.68 MPH

[TSi92]

Those SE-R sentras can pul nice 60ft's because they come with a LSD from the factory. FWD dsm's have open ffront diff, so it's really hard to get a desent 60ft even with DR's

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'92 Talon TSi FWD
K&N cut air can, DDP mbc @ 15 psi
14.71@96 2.5 60ft

[BigTone]

In my fwd Laser a/t my best 60' is a 2.1. This is using nitto555r's. My best result came from heating up the tire(s) until I saw smoke and then letting off. I can build plenty of boost at the line but that time I left at about 10psi. The track had also been freshly treated with a nice layer of VHT. A normal "good" launch with the DR's is a 2.2. My suspension is 122k miles old so this might have an effect on my 60's. for comparison, a normal "good" launch on my street tires is a 2.4. I am hoping that a stiffer suspension and new motor mounts will get me closer or even below 2.0.

Tony
92 laser fwd a/t
13.4 @ 106

[mavisky]

ted i'll get you some results from my new phantom grip lsd on stockers, and then hopefully i can sucker some drag radials out of my parents this fall.

[countersniper]

Originally posted by TSi92
, so it's really hard to get a desent 60ft even with DR's


Absolutely incorrect!

[countersniper]

Originally posted by BigTone
A normal "good" launch with the DR's is a 2.2.

And yet another totally and absolutley incorrect statement!

BTW: Did any of you see the word "slicks" in the title? Just curious.

[Captain Morgan]

Sorry to be OT but Mavisky, couldn't help but seeing ft. wayne in your sig pic...are you from there?

[Quadcylla]

PM or email him for off topic discussions.

Did anyone else notice how freekin old this thread is? :D

What I've learned. You have to launch hard enough to avoid bogging. If above that point you wheel hop very early then it's quite likely you have ripped or torn motor mounts. This will greatly impeded your 60 ft times. What you want is to launch just under the tire spin point and it you can't get there because you are wheel hopping you need to fix it.

Wheel hop can be addressed with stiffer motor mounts or tires with soft sidewalls (slicks). The first thing to do is check your motor mounts. If any are ripped or torn replace them.

Next consider stiffer mounts. There are some ways to stiffen the stock ones with window weld or polyethylene cutting board peices. There are also energy suspension inserts to consider for the front and back mounts. Or if you are hard core go with the prothane motor mounts. The hard the mount the more vibration will be transfered to the car while driving. If you have mods like cams and/or removed balance shafts prepare for lots of vibes (ie can't see out your mirrors at idle) with the prothanes. The other ways to stiffen will vibrate less but you'll still notice it.

With stiffer mounts you should not be hitting wheel hop before tire spin. Don't forget that it's wheel hop that will bust your differential!!! You have to decide wether the vibrations are worth it.

You could just go slicks and it will reduce wheel hop due to the softer side walls but not totally. And wheel hoping with slicks and the extra power will be very harmful to driveline parts like your differential. I suggest don't go past drag radials unless you have stiffened your motor mounts at least. Actually I would recommend not getting slicks untill you have an LSD too.

So now that you don't get wheel hop you have a much deeper 'sweet spot' between bog and spin to play with. This will make for better 60 fts as well as more consistancy. It will also allow you to go to stickier tires and get better times. If you have ripped mounts stickier tires aren't going to help much because they will hop just as easily.

Stiff mounts and drag radials or green DOT retreads or sticky street tires should net you 2.0s~2.2s 60 fts (depending on driver skill/track conditions etc).

Next consider an LSD. Really consider saving up for the Quaife as opposed to getting a Phantom or B&M. It's a much better unit and will not impede daily driving or road course driving. 2 tires are better then one. Without an LSD as soon as one tire starts to spin or hop all the power is transferred there... you really are only a 1WD car. With the LSD if one tire starts spinning more power is transfered to the other tire. In other words neither will spin... until enough power is put down to sptin both of them. Huge improvement.

The other bonus of this is you can now heat up your tires before a run. Without and LSD you can only spin and heat up one tire in the burn out box which doesn't help you really at all. With and LSD you can burn them both out and get a better launch.

So now that you have good mounts and a LSD the best thing you can do for yourself is get some slicks. With all this done you can get consistant 1.8s or better.

[Cjburn2]

Getting a Quaife is a great idea, period. I would do all the suspension bushings to prevent unwanted motion of the suspension under load, a full suspension, then slicks. Sentra's viscous coupling is known to fail under high stress situations and those guys usually go with a quaife (which is now discontinued for the Sentra SER). There's a little known product gaining alot of
popularity but requires fab work not everyone is capable of performing. In Honda's it's called a radius rod, someone in the SR community had said they were starting to develop one for drag use. This product connects the A-arm to piece of the subframe (can't remember where now). It prevents the A arm from moving fore and aft, basically preventing ANY tire from skipping. It is supposed to help alot and I'll try and dig up some links about it.
http://www.sr20deforum.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=17181&highlight=Big+boost+a+arm
http://hybrid2.honda-perf.org/tech/z10.html
Just some ideas....

[Cjburn2]

I forgot, Mickey Thompson does not reccomend that FWD cars do a burn out on their slicks. They state that we're incapable of doing a burn-out long enough to properly heat the slick. My friend just pulled the E brack and went nuts. If you're a little squeamish about doing that then no burnout is better than doing a little one, a little burn out will actually make the slick, well, slick and not sticky...at least according to MT's website.

[countersniper]

Originally posted by Quadcylla
PM or email him for off topic discussions.

Did anyone else notice how freekin old this thread is? :D



Holy crap, 2 years. I sure as hell didn't look!

Now that's funny.

[mavisky]

Originally posted by Cjburn2
I forgot, Mickey Thompson does not reccomend that FWD cars do a burn out on their slicks. They state that we're incapable of doing a burn-out long enough to properly heat the slick. My friend just pulled the E brack and went nuts. If you're a little squeamish about doing that then no burnout is better than doing a little one, a little burn out will actually make the slick, well, slick and not sticky...at least according to MT's website.

well the most important thing isn't the time or the severity, but the temperature. i'd get a digital pyrometer to checkout the temps after a few different burnouts til knew how long i needed to do them in order to get the right temperature.

[NoTraction98]

My best is a 1.9 in my 16g powered 98 but I have only been once to the track on slicks. It was easy to get that though.

My buddy with a 20g powered 95 recently got a 1.80 and I think he may be able to squeak into the 1.7s.

Both cars are running stock diffs...I think a quaife would make a major difference.