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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I've been scouring the classifieds for a few months now, still looking for a pristine 98-99 2G GS-T/GSX/TSi (98), to very little luck. But after reading through a lot of the old CW posts, I'm sort of having second thoughts about looking for a *new* car and just being happy with what I've got. I'm not in a money crunch, but I'm not ready to plunk down $5K for a 6 bolt motor swap if the existing 7 bolt shits the bed. Is having a 2G (or a late model 1G DSM) like driving with a live grenade? Is crankwalk just an unpredictable happening? It seems like it doesn't matter if you're running basic mods with some bolt-on parts here and there, or if you've got a big 16G hooked up; crankwalk can happen at ANY time, ANY mileage, with ANY given mods...

Are there any TRIED and TRUE preventative things to do/things that owners with high mileage 7 bolts have done, such as adding 3rd gen lifters(?), de-activating the clutch down startup, switching to synthetic motor oil, changing oil at 2K-2.5K miles, driving (for the most part) pretty conservatively, checking spec(?)/crank play(?) while the cars on a lift, etc etc.? I've checked out VFaq, great articles and How-To's, but theres so many different CRANKWALK THIS and CRANKWALK THAT "mis"-information that I may have read that I really just don't get...

Let's say I find myself a late model 2G, let's say for shits and giggles its a GS-T driven by an old lady, with no modifications, oil changes at every 3500 miles, 100K miles. If I were to take this to a mechanic friend, have him throw it up on the lift, and tell him to "check for play in the crank", assuming he correctly can *diagnose/check* the crankshaft(?), and says theres 0" play(?), am I home free? Before making any sort of offer, I'd take it to a mechanic anyway for a compression test to check things out.

I'm not a car guy. Just gonna say that right off the bat and I'm probably going to get flamed for this entire post by you DSM Gurus; I apologize if this article is in "ill-taste/form"...just looking for some truths here. I'm an 18 year old kid that just wants to find out a bit more about how things work. I've been racing pocketbikes for the past 5 years of my life, and I just kinda want to "move on" and shed that kiddy image. A big inline four 600 is out of the question; I've seen too many friends (actually lost a family member) to motorcycle accidents and I'm not about to go down anytime soon (knock on wood) aboard a sportbike. I'm enjoying what I've got now (naturally aspirated 1.8L Celica GT), I'm staying up at college next year and I'm not commuting anymore, and it sucks when I see classmates jump into their EVO's and SRT4s around campus and bomb around...kinda like a bit of fanboy jealousy but certainly not in a bad way. I'd just like to have a nice little daily driver (well, sorta) to have some fun with, and the GS-T kinda fits that equation; the 7 bolt crankwalk problems that supposedly affect 15%(?) of 2G's kinda throws me off though :confused: . Just want something to have my fun with, but not some sort of money pit. I think that last line may may shake up the validity of this entire post, but just looking for your thoughts and input on my *situation*. :dunno:

If you've read this far, I appreciate your time!
 

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To be honest, you sound a hell of a lot more ejumacated than most new guys in here, take it from a newb who's been on here a while. From what I've gathered and simply put...as 7 bolt is like a new born baby...you have to take good care of it, or you are gonna kill it. Preventative maitenance is always good. And you know where you ca always find help...it almost definately won't be from me, but yea, there are a ton of people on here that know these cars inside and out.
 

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I'm fairly impressed. Way to do research and start out your DSMTalk life. :)

Just to point this out...people have walked 6 bolts too. Any engine can walk, but 7 bolts are notorious for it.

The 7 bolts walking has many theories as to why/when it happens. Last theory I read was about the oil squirters sticking open, causing loss of oil flow to the main bearings, since they are on the main bearing oil galley, chewing them quickly from oil deprivation.

But, I also read that later model 7 bolts had a redesigned thrust bearing and these builds seem to be a lot better. Supposedly later model 7 bolts (98-99) haven't had nearly the issues earlier models did. But, it's mostly speculation.

I had a 7 bolt, and it had 137k on the clock when I bought it, but it only made it to 144k before I spun a bearing, just to find out all my bearings were toast. I never checked end play, but I did have some major issues with timing dives that seemed to have no solution, so I'm sure I was walking.

You can get a 6 bolt swap into a 2g for a lot cheaper than $5-6k; that's not including the cost of a 2g though. You can build one yourself and do the necessary pigtails and swapping, or you can do like I did, and buy the 6 bolt 2g swap from Karking. Fresh build, all brand new parts, and no sensor swapping, pig tailing, or plug swapping for $2200. It comes with almost all brand new parts (except the actual head, block, oil pan, intake manifold, and cams, and crank (polished virgin crank). All other internals are brand new. It's already modified for everything you need, straight off the pallet they send it on. Just plunk it in, hook up your wires, sensors, and hoses, give 'er some fluids, and fire it up.

Now, this engine is a mostly stock replacement engine, with some modifications/perks such as balance shaft elimination, no oil squirters, ARP head studs, revised lifters, 1g cams, MLS headgasket, and some other fun stuff, but it's not recommended to push these engines too much. I've been told by places such as RRE and Slowboy that they wouldn't recommend trying for over 350whp on an engine with no squirters (unless the internals are forged). I'll probably push it and see what it does.
 

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You started out well here. Read Esky's post and be sure to understand it, and you'll know as much as I know, and just about anyone else, when it comes to crankwalk. The problem with this issue, is even Mitsubishi hasn't admitted why it happens, and it's possible they don't know. Generally just taking care of the engine is as much as you can do, because as far as I can tell, when they do it, they do it and there's not much you can do to stop it.

Don't let that keep you away from buying a DSM though, because they're amazingly fun cars. You'll save a lot of money if you're willing to do the majority of the work yourself too. As with any turbo car, they need babied, they need maintenance and they don't like to wait longer than they are supposed to.

I'm no expert, but I assure you that about anything you'll need to know as a DSM owner can be found on this site, DSMtuners.com, and VFAQ.
 

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Gah, it's too late for me...re-reading my first post, I didn't make as much sense as I meant to.

Like you have already pretty much found out, crankwalk theories are all over the place. And really, don't worry about what you can do to try and prevent it...because from what I've seen and witnessed, it can happen to a brand new 7 bolt build...it can happen to babied 30k, or to a well beaten 150k old engine...and anywhere in between. I would venture to say it wouldn't hurt to really stay on top of the routine maintenance stuff to help, but since we don't know what causes it, we're basically at the mercy of whatever the engine decides.

Mitsubishi hasn't recognized the issue as a build problem because it would mean they would have a massive recall to handle, and through paperwork and dodging, they've managed to "prove" that this issue is not apparent in all 7 bolts, of the same year/design or otherwise, and that way they don't have take responsibility for it. As far as I'm concerned, it was probably one guy on a line every Monday and Friday, turning out bad bearing sets for a couple years. :dunno:

Like Hellvector said...I wouldn't let the 7 bolt steer you away from buying another DSM (actually...in about a week, I will be :eek:). They are fun as hell, and just as addicting. But, like you said, if you can actually get the person to allow you to do a compression test, check for end play...hell, do it. But just because there isn't any end play doesn't mean it won't develop. But, if it does happen, it's a good reason to step into a 6 bolt :cool:

If you want to own a DSM for fun and not have it be a money pit...heh...I applaud you if you can. So far, I haven't been able to stick to that same goal that I started with. :eek:
 

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Im trying to figure out where this guy got "5k" for a 6 bolt swap? :confused:
I got my BRAND new 6 bolt bottom end with 2g pistons/1g big rods for 650.I picked up a super clean 1g head for 200.Add some cams, fmic, b16g and supporting mods and im still under 3k.
 

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I'm guessing he was figuring that a shop would get it all together, and install it, instead of doing his own work. Which, on something like that, I don't blame him, I'd be very uneasy about building a motor by myself right now, with the whole newb mod still goin' on.
 

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Esky said:
Mitsubishi hasn't recognized the issue

They sort of did when they turned the evo engine around and changed the clutch design as well as designing the engines with a 1 piece thrust bearing. That pretty much solves the issue. 98-99 dsms have the same 1 piece thrust bearing, they are actually a diferant 7 bolt than the 95 2g's, or the 96 to 97(which seem to have the most issues). They never admitted it publically like you said, but they changed things in their design.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Guys, I appreciate all the fast responses and help! I'll just keep my eyes in the classifieds and maybe I'll get lucky. Until then, I'll keep browsing through the forums and VFaq to see if I can scrape out any more DSM knowledge. :cool:

Thanks again for all the help!

BTW, Empie, I just threw that *figure* out there, I figured that the easiest way to get a hold of a 6 bolt would be to find a salvaged 1G with a good block, maybe something along those lines; like I said before, aside from general maintenance on a car I've got about zero knowledge when it comes to wastegates, boost controllers, ball bearing turbos and intake manifolds; my little estimate was well off the swapping norm. I've seen a few people with $K's+ in motor builds on a 6 bolt, so I just kinda chucked that out there. But thanks to everyone for all their input! :eek:
 

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My apologies for that 4g64, I meant publicly recognize (admit, like you said) that the issue was due to something they had in the original design, or something they had control over. But yes, they definitely knew the issue was there, and as stated, they did make changes to rectify the situation in their later builds. That way, they keep the money from the walkers, keep the money from the possible recall responsibility, and keep the money from the later, hopefully fixed builds. Yay for money.

Good luck in your search buddy, you can pick up a decent DSM and make it reliable and fast. If you can find a junkyard car, or a good deal, you can have some fun, and learn a ton about all this fun stuff they call performance mods and cars in general. I know I did, and I still consider myself a noob, especially compared to some of the mechies on here. :cool:
 

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If you end up stickin' around, I think you'll do alright around here, you seem to have skipped the completely stupid and arrogant part that most new guys get when they come on here, like I did, lol. Good luck finding something you like.
 
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