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Head Gasket size hurt compression??

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feeltheimpulse

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Discussion starter · #1 ·
I blew my Head Gasket, and i have been callin around.. i am going have to have it shaved down becaues i did warp the head. so i think i am going to have to get a bigger sized head gasket... i heard it was like a 030 on there now as stock... if i get a 040 with the semi stock motor/turbo (1991 gsx eclipse).. and not much done to the engine right away will i have compression problems? or what.. I know that i am going to be doing some Moderate tunning in the future, i just dont know if i should just go w/ the bigger one now or stick witht the stock one with my head shaved down... CONFUSSED!.... or should i wait until i get bigger things for my car.. i just dont want to rip the effin head off so many times... PAin in My ...

Please help
Thanks, Rob
 
Discussion starter · #5 ·
4g63talonawd said:
Get a mitsubishi 4 layer metal head gasket. It a little thicker than the stock one.
Click to expand...
Im am getting an upgradded head gasket.. weither it is a multi layer metal one or composit.. i am just worried about the size.. 4 layer or not.. they still have differenent thicknesses... right??

Rob
 
#6 ·
Rob,

Was this the first time you've had the head decked? If so, you can probably get by with just the stock mitsu HG. It will slightly (very slightly) increase your compression numbers. Nothing to get too worried about. If you are really concerned or don't know the answer to the previous question, you can go the Mitsu MLHG.
 
#8 · (Edited)
pUtInExIm said:
Actually it does however slight it may be.
Click to expand...
Care to indulge me and tell me how? Any additional slack in the timing belt because of the difference in thickness will be taken up upon proper TB tensioning. Or are we just splitting engineering hairs here, but there isn't any real world difference? Kinda like arguing that water IS compressible.... :rolleyes:
 
Discussion starter · #9 ·
Red1991TSI said:
Rob,

Was this the first time you've had the head decked? If so, you can probably get by with just the stock mitsu HG. It will slightly (very slightly) increase your compression numbers. Nothing to get too worried about. If you are really concerned or don't know the answer to the previous question, you can go the Mitsu MLHG.
Click to expand...
yah it was the first time.. my uncle is the one who is going to hone down my head.. was worried about it being too warped.. i told him i didnt think it would be that much of a problem just to get it shaved down and just the hell with it... This is the first major thing that went wrong with the car all the way from 91.. so i mean i dont think that the car was beat to death or anything.. is it pretty easy to warp the head that bad from blowing a hg? And so what your telling me is that i should just go with the stock phrypon (sp) hg...? and not waste my money on a four layer one, or stay with the 030 but in a multi layer/ composit..

Thanks for your help guys,
Rob
 
#10 ·
feeltheimpulse said:
And so what your telling me is that i should just go with the stock phrypon (sp) hg...? and not waste my money on a four layer one, or stay with the 030 but in a multi layer/ composit..
Rob
Click to expand...
I can't speak as to how warped a head will become because I've never blown my HG. Some will be ok, other will be warped. If you have it shaved (as slight as necessary to get it flat) then you should be ok with the original MITSU gasket. Composite yes, multi-layer not sure. Call any Mitsu dealership and as for the factory original HG for your year (91 I believe). Unless you're pushing high boost (over 20 lbs) I wouldn't bother witht he MLS HG (I know guys, some of you will disagree) but I think most would agree that for mild applications the stock one will work just fine. The factory composite ones are a little more forgiving of minor surface defects. With the MLS you pretty much need a surgically clean surface on both the head and block.

Some will recommend the Permatex copper gasket spray, some won't. I'm still open as to which is a better way to go.

Some thoughts on that would be good for what you're looking to do. Any thoughts guys?
 
#11 ·
I had the same problem, DO NOT PUT A STOCK FELT HEAD GASKET ON!!!! My brother ended up doing this, and then said that he had the car fix, and I ended buying it, well here with the head shaved, the head gasket keeps on blowing on the the oil side.. So I went out and bought the OEM Metal head gasket,
 
#13 ·
Red1991TSI said:
Don't think HG thickness has anything to do with timing... Usually has to do with clearance and compression.
Click to expand...
Its not that hard to figure out, if you shorten the distance between the gears its gonna change the valve timing. And no it prolly wouldnt be that much of a difference if the head head was just shaved but if the head was shaved and the block decked i could see you running into problems with the timing.

Matt
 
#14 ·
berger said:
Its not that hard to figure out, if you shorten the distance between the gears its gonna change the valve timing. And no it prolly wouldnt be that much of a difference if the head head was just shaved but if the head was shaved and the block decked i could see you running into problems with the timing.

Matt
Click to expand...
Uhh, shorten the distance between which gears? Between the cam gears and the crank shaft gear? It's all going to rotate the same. Any additional slack (Like in the 1000'th of an inch" will be taken up by the idler pully and TB tensioner.

If both were shaved and a proper thickness HG not installed I could see valves colliding but I still don't see any timing change... You're still going to time your car to 5' BTDC.

I still don't get it. Not trying to be difficult, just don't see it in a "real world" aspect. Like I mentioned before, water IS compressible. Just not enough to even think about!
 
#15 ·
Ok you know that when you use the 4g63 cam gears on a 4g64 you have to change the location of the timing marks. Its the same thing except the deck hight is higher not lower. And you do know that VALVE timing and IGNISSION timing are two different things right. Because you are bringing them both up. Im not talking about ignission timing.
 
Discussion starter · #16 ·
So i think i made my decission.. im hoping to go with kometic multi layer gasket I called a couple shops.. this guys says he has them speical made or some bs like that.. sounds pretty nice.. he said that it may hender my speed a little bit but nothing dramatic at all.. he said once i get my head blasted... or pressed (depending on how warped it is) he can compansait.. all i have to do is let him know was how bad it was warped and he said he'll hook me up.. 90 bucks for a new head gasket.. not bad 90 bucks for some arp head studs.. and i'll be set... If you have ANY suggestions please help.. i am very open to ideas, as long as they are from someone who knows there dsm's then i'll be happy!

Thanks, Rob
 
#17 ·
berger said:
Ok you know that when you use the 4g63 cam gears on a 4g64 you have to change the location of the timing marks. Its the same thing except the deck hight is higher not lower. And you do know that VALVE timing and IGNISSION timing are two different things right. Because you are bringing them both up. Im not talking about ignission timing.
Click to expand...
I don't know everything about the 4g64 swap but I know that the distance is FAR greater than just milling of the head and/or block. Either way we'll just call it done. I don't think I'm convinced it make much difference but either way it's been interesting. :)

Later
 
#18 ·
Definitly go stock if everything else is stock. if your having the head shaved, depending on how much, the compression ratio will go up which is a good thing
 
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