Well im trying to see what turbo to upgrade to. The green supports up to 500hp while price wise the ete32 only supports 460. I need to know if anybody has used the green or the ete32 from extreme turbo. I want to know the spool up characteristics of both turbos and your best opinion on what i should get. I just havent heard too many things about the green like i have the mutt turbos. thanks again
FP green or mutt ETE32
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<<<My question is, why doesn't DSM-Performance build a car, and install a Mutt, and show what it can do? >>>
I've offered to do that on several occasions,and I've been asking them that question since the beginning of time. Maybe some day they'll do that, now that I have a daily driver, I'd be more in a position to offer my own car up as a tuning bed.
I've offered to do that on several occasions,and I've been asking them that question since the beginning of time. Maybe some day they'll do that, now that I have a daily driver, I'd be more in a position to offer my own car up as a tuning bed.
I have been wondering about that too. However, if you think about it. There are not many people able to run that great times even with the same bolt on parts. Tuning is one big issue, the condition of the car, the other is the driver themselves not willing to break parts. I for one am not willing to do WOT run from 1st-4th flooring the pedal w/o lifting letting it bounce off the rev limiter on every shift.
I think DSM-performance made a point they want to see normal street cars (consumers like us) running quick time to prove the turbo.
It takes time, perhaps even never but I strongly believe someday, someone will prove their new MF1 works. The learning curve is there but we will get there someday. I prefer to see avg consumer showing results rather than just a queen of the crowd deal.
Is there any point bolting a turbo to a well tuned car knowing it will run good with any turbo thrown at it? Yes, but only to show what the turbo can do but does it mean every consumer like us going to fully utilize it? No.
Just take an example on the FP big T28, it runs so well on Loren's car but who else other Loren or FP has gone quicker on that turbo? None yet, when it bolt-on to ProjectGSX car, guess what?
Anyway, this is by no mean trying to insult ProjectGSX but just to prove a fact that there are other factors involved, other than the turbo itself.
I think DSM-performance made a point they want to see normal street cars (consumers like us) running quick time to prove the turbo.
It takes time, perhaps even never but I strongly believe someday, someone will prove their new MF1 works. The learning curve is there but we will get there someday. I prefer to see avg consumer showing results rather than just a queen of the crowd deal.
Is there any point bolting a turbo to a well tuned car knowing it will run good with any turbo thrown at it? Yes, but only to show what the turbo can do but does it mean every consumer like us going to fully utilize it? No.
Just take an example on the FP big T28, it runs so well on Loren's car but who else other Loren or FP has gone quicker on that turbo? None yet, when it bolt-on to ProjectGSX car, guess what?
Anyway, this is by no mean trying to insult ProjectGSX but just to prove a fact that there are other factors involved, other than the turbo itself.
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This is so funny, because the "green" gets thrown around on this board like it's a T-25 replacement, basic upgrade. I agree that a lot of peole on this board and ones that I have talked to personaly buy a bigger turbo to make up for bad or a lack of tuning ability. I think there is a recent post on here about someone with some decent mods that is making some pathetiic numbers. I am sorry if that is harsh but tuning and driving will do more for gains than adding more parts.
As for comparing turbos. Just call the vendors and "LEARN how to read and LOOK at the compressor maps and find which turbo will work for you". Basically take the names off all the turbos and find the one you like and the one that'll fit your needs.
As for comparing turbos. Just call the vendors and "LEARN how to read and LOOK at the compressor maps and find which turbo will work for you". Basically take the names off all the turbos and find the one you like and the one that'll fit your needs.
Looks like I'll throw my 2 dimes into the ashtray....
I'm assuming all the people on here know what mods they need to utilize a certain turbo. Otherwise they would be saying, "I'm getting a Red with stock sidemount." I just fail to see that stupidity on these boards yet. I, like most others, want the "turbo assurance" when making purchases. I'll explain. Its great that you got a Small 16G to 400hp(dyno to back that up??) But most consumers, like i, want the assurance that we can go much faster if need be. What PSI will I run when I hook up the Green??? I don't know. I haven't tuned it yet. Am I still getting the Forced Performance turbo??? Yes I am. It's not "rocket science" to calculate what you will need to take advantage of the larger turbo. Tuning??? What's the difficulty in this part of owning a car? Simple physics and common sense should reign in this portion of modding a car. Fulling utilizing a turbo?? How many of use actually will ever do that. I'm positive that 90% of the people here are street drivers..Most of us turn down the boost to "pussy" levels because we're not trying to break into the 10's.
Why the Green?? because for a few hundred more, I can spank the shit out of any 14b,16G-20G. Tuning is a part of car know-how, not an aquired skill, in my opinion. And I can still take it out on the street, even if I'm still running "pussy" PSI. I think the Green should be a direct replacement for the T25. What happens when you've tuned the hell out of that 16G and you're still not happy. You want to shell out another $1000??? Why waste your time? If you guys disagree, fine. Theres bound to be several points of view on this.
I'm assuming all the people on here know what mods they need to utilize a certain turbo. Otherwise they would be saying, "I'm getting a Red with stock sidemount." I just fail to see that stupidity on these boards yet. I, like most others, want the "turbo assurance" when making purchases. I'll explain. Its great that you got a Small 16G to 400hp(dyno to back that up??) But most consumers, like i, want the assurance that we can go much faster if need be. What PSI will I run when I hook up the Green??? I don't know. I haven't tuned it yet. Am I still getting the Forced Performance turbo??? Yes I am. It's not "rocket science" to calculate what you will need to take advantage of the larger turbo. Tuning??? What's the difficulty in this part of owning a car? Simple physics and common sense should reign in this portion of modding a car. Fulling utilizing a turbo?? How many of use actually will ever do that. I'm positive that 90% of the people here are street drivers..Most of us turn down the boost to "pussy" levels because we're not trying to break into the 10's.
Why the Green?? because for a few hundred more, I can spank the shit out of any 14b,16G-20G. Tuning is a part of car know-how, not an aquired skill, in my opinion. And I can still take it out on the street, even if I'm still running "pussy" PSI. I think the Green should be a direct replacement for the T25. What happens when you've tuned the hell out of that 16G and you're still not happy. You want to shell out another $1000??? Why waste your time? If you guys disagree, fine. Theres bound to be several points of view on this.
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good point'
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Aslan, there is a difference between facts and theroy. That was theroy, not fact.NosLaser said:
That's besides the point though. Someone let me use a ML3 and I'll test it against my TDO6 20g. Hell I'll even pay shipping both ways. I'm not about to buy one though.
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I really don't want to get into the Green vs. Mutt argument, but I just have one question, and I do not mean for it to sound like a smart ass one.jw said:
If some of you guys admit that these MF1 turbos, etc. are not proven, what makes you so confident that they are so good?
This question has been asked and answered so many times that I feel it's getting old. Search through the archieve and you will see a bunch.dsm1995gst said:
Also, even if a turbo is not good does not automatically put it into the bad category. Shouldnt there be a in-between? I mean dont tell me there is only black and white. What about grey?
Why do you think the MF1 is bad? Is there hard evidence that the turbo is not working? Anyone has a 16G/20G upgrade to MF1 turbo and run slower time on the turbo? Shouldnt we wait till the race season is over before we jump to any conclusion?
Hehe, I saw this thread before there were any replies yet and just shook my head and laughed.
There has been some good points made and some unproven speculation thrown around, AGAIN. Go figure.
And once again the results thus far are the same people. The FP Green turbo has supported runs in the low 10's.
The MF1 line has not put down solid numbers yet. Why, I don't know or care. I myself got a MF1 L3 turbo, did as much of a freakin review as possible with the track here being closed. I'd give my left nut for the track to open today to put some damn numbers up here for everyone that can't seem to find the search button for this same topic, geez. Hell, if I had got a Green, the track would still be closed, hehe.
I've posted my spool rpms and psi, do a search and compare to what the Green spools at.
I won't sit here and say get an ETA32, simply because I have one. In fact anyone that's been here for awhile knows EXACTLY why I got one. That job is unfinished and unfortunately will remain that way until the track opens, May 2nd. As mentioned above there will be no sugar coating, only the details and a slip. Good or bad, no excuses.
If someone with supporting mods asked me today which to buy, I'd say get a Green without a doubt. I base that only on the numbers proven thus far, not one thing else. If someone asked me if I thought they could runs 10's on a Green, I'd say, "Nope." And I base that one only on the fact that if you are asking, you can't handle a Green. Fact! If I'm wrong, I say prove me wrong.
Let the hype cease, until the numbers can back it up. Period. Keep your pie-hole shut unless you got a mf1 equipped dsm's timeslip and all the details!
As for me, all I can say thus far is that the eta32 impresses me and I'm confident that it'll take me where I want to be, much easier than a 16g would. I really like the fact that I was able to run only 10 psi (because of a slipping clutch) and got no boost creep on the internal gate. I also love the 21 psi of boosted grin on 91 octane pump gas I get daily. I consider it's spool-up perfect. 550 injectors maxed on pump gas. 24 psi and zero knock sums on a simple 100 and 91 octane UL mix of 2:1. The awd is downright squirrely with a good launch on a decent road. A local member rode in and drove my car and said the difference over his 16g'd Eclipse was huge and absolutely noticeable. Those are the real facts thus far as I know them to be. And I'd still say get a Green, based on the numbers...
There has been some good points made and some unproven speculation thrown around, AGAIN. Go figure.
And once again the results thus far are the same people. The FP Green turbo has supported runs in the low 10's.
The MF1 line has not put down solid numbers yet. Why, I don't know or care. I myself got a MF1 L3 turbo, did as much of a freakin review as possible with the track here being closed. I'd give my left nut for the track to open today to put some damn numbers up here for everyone that can't seem to find the search button for this same topic, geez. Hell, if I had got a Green, the track would still be closed, hehe.
I've posted my spool rpms and psi, do a search and compare to what the Green spools at.
I won't sit here and say get an ETA32, simply because I have one. In fact anyone that's been here for awhile knows EXACTLY why I got one. That job is unfinished and unfortunately will remain that way until the track opens, May 2nd. As mentioned above there will be no sugar coating, only the details and a slip. Good or bad, no excuses.
If someone with supporting mods asked me today which to buy, I'd say get a Green without a doubt. I base that only on the numbers proven thus far, not one thing else. If someone asked me if I thought they could runs 10's on a Green, I'd say, "Nope." And I base that one only on the fact that if you are asking, you can't handle a Green. Fact! If I'm wrong, I say prove me wrong.
Let the hype cease, until the numbers can back it up. Period. Keep your pie-hole shut unless you got a mf1 equipped dsm's timeslip and all the details!
As for me, all I can say thus far is that the eta32 impresses me and I'm confident that it'll take me where I want to be, much easier than a 16g would. I really like the fact that I was able to run only 10 psi (because of a slipping clutch) and got no boost creep on the internal gate. I also love the 21 psi of boosted grin on 91 octane pump gas I get daily. I consider it's spool-up perfect. 550 injectors maxed on pump gas. 24 psi and zero knock sums on a simple 100 and 91 octane UL mix of 2:1. The awd is downright squirrely with a good launch on a decent road. A local member rode in and drove my car and said the difference over his 16g'd Eclipse was huge and absolutely noticeable. Those are the real facts thus far as I know them to be.
And I'd still say get a Green, based on the numbers...<<<Keep your pie-hole shut unless you got a mf1 equipped dsm's timeslip and all the details! >>>
Hehe. When the world's very first Mutt turbo came out, it had a TDO5H back wheel, which is buy far inferior to a T3 hi-Flow or a TDO6H. Can we at least all agree on that one? Okay. With that in the bag, we ran 11.77 at 114 with an ignition miss in 4th gear in a full weight AWD that made 400hp to the wheels. In a level one. With a shitty TDO5H back wheel. Then the DSM Shop broke up, and thus far no attempts to do independant testing in the same manner as it was done then. With those NUMBERS in mind, how bad can a turbo that has a more efficient compressor wheel, a better built center section, and a MUCH better exhaust wheel possibly be? (No Van, this post isn't directed at you, I simply used something you said to start the convrsation.) Personally, I don't care which turbo you choose. They are both good turbos. This thread was about the Mutt level 3 vs. the Green Turbo, and which one can be called 'better.' If you break each turbo down to it's basic components, you get this:
Mutt Green
Compressor wheel: 50 trim Compressor wheel: 50 trim
Compressor housing: Garrett Compresso housing: machined 20G
Exhaust wheel: T3 Hi-Flow Exhaust wheel: TDO6H
Exhaust housing: 7cm Exhaust housing: 7cm
If you break down the parts in the above chart, you will see both turbos have the same compressor wheel, the Mutt gains an advantage by having a Garrett wheel in a true Garrett housing instead of a machined Mitsu housing, the exhaust housings are equal (however the Mutt's portwork is going to be better) and the T3 hi-flow WILL out-flow a TDO6H wheel. Period. The efficiency of the Mutt is also going to allow it to spool faster, and have the capacity to run higher boost. This is such a mute discussion. I said it before, Greens have gone faster simply because no one has really stepped up to the plate with a Mutt 3 yet. But if you look at the above comparison (and those are FACTS) you will see he Mutt has the capacity to make more power, and be a more efficient turbo. It's like comparing a 1 gallon bucket to a 2 gallon bucket. As much as you like the 1 gallon, as popular and proven as the 1 gallon is, the 2 gallon WILL hold more water. Period. End of discussion. Someone said earlier "forget the names, forget the shops they are from, just look at each turbo, and pick the one you think is better." Awesome. Couldn't have said it better myself. If you buy a Mutt and don't buy a Green, I'm sure there are 3 other people in line behind you that will buy a Green, and vice-versa.
Hehe. When the world's very first Mutt turbo came out, it had a TDO5H back wheel, which is buy far inferior to a T3 hi-Flow or a TDO6H. Can we at least all agree on that one? Okay. With that in the bag, we ran 11.77 at 114 with an ignition miss in 4th gear in a full weight AWD that made 400hp to the wheels. In a level one. With a shitty TDO5H back wheel. Then the DSM Shop broke up, and thus far no attempts to do independant testing in the same manner as it was done then. With those NUMBERS in mind, how bad can a turbo that has a more efficient compressor wheel, a better built center section, and a MUCH better exhaust wheel possibly be? (No Van, this post isn't directed at you, I simply used something you said to start the convrsation.) Personally, I don't care which turbo you choose. They are both good turbos. This thread was about the Mutt level 3 vs. the Green Turbo, and which one can be called 'better.' If you break each turbo down to it's basic components, you get this:
Mutt Green
Compressor wheel: 50 trim Compressor wheel: 50 trim
Compressor housing: Garrett Compresso housing: machined 20G
Exhaust wheel: T3 Hi-Flow Exhaust wheel: TDO6H
Exhaust housing: 7cm Exhaust housing: 7cm
If you break down the parts in the above chart, you will see both turbos have the same compressor wheel, the Mutt gains an advantage by having a Garrett wheel in a true Garrett housing instead of a machined Mitsu housing, the exhaust housings are equal (however the Mutt's portwork is going to be better) and the T3 hi-flow WILL out-flow a TDO6H wheel. Period. The efficiency of the Mutt is also going to allow it to spool faster, and have the capacity to run higher boost. This is such a mute discussion. I said it before, Greens have gone faster simply because no one has really stepped up to the plate with a Mutt 3 yet. But if you look at the above comparison (and those are FACTS) you will see he Mutt has the capacity to make more power, and be a more efficient turbo. It's like comparing a 1 gallon bucket to a 2 gallon bucket. As much as you like the 1 gallon, as popular and proven as the 1 gallon is, the 2 gallon WILL hold more water. Period. End of discussion. Someone said earlier "forget the names, forget the shops they are from, just look at each turbo, and pick the one you think is better." Awesome. Couldn't have said it better myself. If you buy a Mutt and don't buy a Green, I'm sure there are 3 other people in line behind you that will buy a Green, and vice-versa.
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I don't think the MF1 is bad. I have no idea concerning its performance, and I don't even necessarily care if it performs well or not, because I don't have it.jw said:
I was just asking why some people are so confident in it, yet they agree that it hasn't been proven.
I have the HRC S-20G, another turbo that hasn't been proven, and also a turbo that probably gets busted on as much as the Mutts do. I don't come on here telling everybody how great it is (not saying that this is what you specifically are doing) and that they should get it, and that I know it will run good times once I get to the track. I don't have confidence in the turbo, as I have no reason to. I was just curious as to why some people with Mutts have so much confidence in them, even some people who don't even have the turbo yet.
If I go to the track or dyno and get some good numbers, then I will tell people my experiences with it, and say "look maybe some of the things people say about it aren't true." But as of now, like Van said, the only thing I can really talk about is how it "feels."
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how does the hrc s 20g feel"
Noslaser, you are pretty optimistic about how these turbos are "going" to perform. While I do agree on housings and wheels, where did the "portwork will be better" comment??? How do you figure that??? You're the one preaching that we should forget what company makes or machines what.
Noslaser... you are forgetting one thing, all the claims of the mutt series turbos is all based on "what it looks like on paper". There needs to be real world results. It doesnt matter what wheels on the hot or cold side, what size housing was used or how much horspower it supposedly supports.
FP did thier job of backing up thier turbos with real testing.
And if DSM perf. was smart they would do it as well. Then the bickering would stop.
But till then i guess i can consider these threads entertainment.
FP did thier job of backing up thier turbos with real testing.
And if DSM perf. was smart they would do it as well. Then the bickering would stop.
But till then i guess i can consider these threads entertainment.
<<<where did the "portwork will be better" comment??? How do you figure that??? >>>
It's done by machine, not by hand. But since no one likes to believe anything I say around here, see for yourself:
As always, all Mutt turbine housings are machine ported. Our turbine housing inlets are ported to match "7cm" gaskets. There hasn't been a single customer yet that hasn't said our porting isn't the best on the market. By using a mill, rather than doing it by hand with a die grinder (puhlease!), every port is guaranteed to come out the exact same size and exact same quality on every turbo. In addition, tubrine exit ports are bell ported for maxmimum flow.
That's right off the site by the way. Let me level with you guys here. I'm not pushing a product here because I could care less, I don't make money if a Mutt turbo sells. However, I am a big stickler of uneducation, and ignorance. If you knock a product because YOU personally don't know anything about it, then that is ignorance in it's purest form. Don't like being called ignorant? Well than GRAB YOUR BALLS, buy a Mutt Level 3, and try it for yourself!! If we all stuck with what is "tried and proven" blah blah blah there there would be no such thing as IMPROVEMENT, or ADVANCEMENT. If everyone was as pussy-footed as some of you guys are, then we'd all still be driving Model T's, and you wouldn't have your DSMs to be complaining about turbos!!! My gripe is everyone is too quick to knock a product without knowledge. If Forced Performance came out with a new turbo that looked like a bad boy, and fit my application, I would buy it and try it out. I'm not limited to one shop, nor am I on anybody's payroll. I go with what looks to be the best product, I don't need someone else to do it for me. But then again, I have no idea what I'm talking about. My car was fast by accident I guess...
It's done by machine, not by hand. But since no one likes to believe anything I say around here, see for yourself:
As always, all Mutt turbine housings are machine ported. Our turbine housing inlets are ported to match "7cm" gaskets. There hasn't been a single customer yet that hasn't said our porting isn't the best on the market. By using a mill, rather than doing it by hand with a die grinder (puhlease!), every port is guaranteed to come out the exact same size and exact same quality on every turbo. In addition, tubrine exit ports are bell ported for maxmimum flow.
That's right off the site by the way. Let me level with you guys here. I'm not pushing a product here because I could care less, I don't make money if a Mutt turbo sells. However, I am a big stickler of uneducation, and ignorance. If you knock a product because YOU personally don't know anything about it, then that is ignorance in it's purest form. Don't like being called ignorant? Well than GRAB YOUR BALLS, buy a Mutt Level 3, and try it for yourself!! If we all stuck with what is "tried and proven" blah blah blah there there would be no such thing as IMPROVEMENT, or ADVANCEMENT. If everyone was as pussy-footed as some of you guys are, then we'd all still be driving Model T's, and you wouldn't have your DSMs to be complaining about turbos!!! My gripe is everyone is too quick to knock a product without knowledge. If Forced Performance came out with a new turbo that looked like a bad boy, and fit my application, I would buy it and try it out. I'm not limited to one shop, nor am I on anybody's payroll. I go with what looks to be the best product, I don't need someone else to do it for me. But then again, I have no idea what I'm talking about. My car was fast by accident I guess...
I dont care if the exhaust housing was done by machine or by hand. It looks pretty well woopee!! You can do a very good job of porting something by hand.NosLaser said:<<<where did the "portwork will be better" comment??? How do you figure that??? >>>
It's done by machine, not by hand. But since no one likes to believe anything I say around here, see for yourself:
As always, all Mutt turbine housings are machine ported. Our turbine housing inlets are ported to match "7cm" gaskets. There hasn't been a single customer yet that hasn't said our porting isn't the best on the market. By using a mill, rather than doing it by hand with a die grinder (puhlease!), every port is guaranteed to come out the exact same size and exact same quality on every turbo. In addition, tubrine exit ports are bell ported for maxmimum flow.
That's right off the site by the way. Let me level with you guys here. I'm not pushing a product here because I could care less, I don't make money if a Mutt turbo sells. However, I am a big stickler of uneducation, and ignorance. If you knock a product because YOU personally don't know anything about it, then that is ignorance in it's purest form. Don't like being called ignorant? Well than GRAB YOUR BALLS, buy a Mutt Level 3, and try it for yourself!! If we all stuck with what is "tried and proven" blah blah blah there there would be no such thing as IMPROVEMENT, or ADVANCEMENT. If everyone was as pussy-footed as some of you guys are, then we'd all still be driving Model T's, and you wouldn't have your DSMs to be complaining about turbos!!! My gripe is everyone is too quick to knock a product without knowledge. If Forced Performance came out with a new turbo that looked like a bad boy, and fit my application, I would buy it and try it out. I'm not limited to one shop, nor am I on anybody's payroll. I go with what looks to be the best product, I don't need someone else to do it for me. But then again, I have no idea what I'm talking about. My car was fast by accident I guess...
I am not going to plop down 1k of my money to test a turbo from someone that has not tested thier own product! Sorry noslaser but the days of the model t are over.
Noone around here is pussyfooting anything. A lot of us dont have an extra couple of thousand dollars laying around to "help" a company test out thier turbos! I for one am not going to buy a turbo that has not been proven to perform in the real world.
The company that brought out the mutts have only themselves to blame for getting thier product knocked. If they would have tested thier own product and shown the results then they woudnt be getting slammed so much. Instead they say how well it flows "on paper". Bench racing just dont cut it.
<<<I dont care if the exhaust housing was done by machine or by hand. It looks pretty well woopee!! You can do a very good job of porting something by hand. >>>
See statement under my sig pic... So, basically what you are saying, is you don't mind the quality that goes into making a product? Now that's smarts!
<<<I for one am not going to buy a turbo that has not been proven to perform in the real world. >>>
It's not my fault you have no balls. Go buy a Green and I hope you run good with it, I honestly do. And what's this 'real world' you are talking about? Oh, you mean planet Earth! Well shit, I know they run 10's with Mutt's on the planet Marklar, but Earth, the 'Real World', that's another story entirely. again.
<<<If they would have tested thier own product and shown the results then they woudnt be getting slammed so much. >>>
That's the only statement of yours that I somewhat agree with. Instead, it relies on the fact that maybe, JUST maybe, their consumers would have some product knowledge of turbos, enough so to ascertain for themselves that "hey, that wheel combination in those housings WILL make power..it just makes sense." But, alas, they are overlooking the fact that DSMers need to have their hands held, and need to be spoonfed on EVERY SINGLE PART out there. No one DARES bolt on a new product and try it for themselves, they want someone else to do it for them. Now perhaps my previous statement will make sense to you; you know, the one about DSMers having no balls? Dude, buy whatever turbo you want. I'm am sick of hearing people cry and whine about it. Don't ask which turbo is better!!!! I am also sick of someone coming on here, asking what turbo is better, when they are already pre-disposed against one of the choices. It's like going to a resteraunt, knowing that you HATE beef stew with a passion, seeing it on the menu, and asking the waitress "So how's the beef stew here?" God it's a shame ignorance isn't painful.
See statement under my sig pic... So, basically what you are saying, is you don't mind the quality that goes into making a product? Now that's smarts!
<<<I for one am not going to buy a turbo that has not been proven to perform in the real world. >>>
It's not my fault you have no balls. Go buy a Green and I hope you run good with it, I honestly do. And what's this 'real world' you are talking about? Oh, you mean planet Earth! Well shit, I know they run 10's with Mutt's on the planet Marklar, but Earth, the 'Real World', that's another story entirely.
again.<<<If they would have tested thier own product and shown the results then they woudnt be getting slammed so much. >>>
That's the only statement of yours that I somewhat agree with. Instead, it relies on the fact that maybe, JUST maybe, their consumers would have some product knowledge of turbos, enough so to ascertain for themselves that "hey, that wheel combination in those housings WILL make power..it just makes sense." But, alas, they are overlooking the fact that DSMers need to have their hands held, and need to be spoonfed on EVERY SINGLE PART out there. No one DARES bolt on a new product and try it for themselves, they want someone else to do it for them. Now perhaps my previous statement will make sense to you; you know, the one about DSMers having no balls? Dude, buy whatever turbo you want. I'm am sick of hearing people cry and whine about it. Don't ask which turbo is better!!!! I am also sick of someone coming on here, asking what turbo is better, when they are already pre-disposed against one of the choices. It's like going to a resteraunt, knowing that you HATE beef stew with a passion, seeing it on the menu, and asking the waitress "So how's the beef stew here?" God it's a shame ignorance isn't painful.
What is so different from hand porting and it being done by machine?? Prove to me that hand porting causes loss of power. I dont care how shiny the inside of the exhaust housing is, as soon as its bolted up i cant see it anyway!
And i will say it again, it has nothing to do with having a set of BALLS! It has to do with me spending a LOT of money on something that has NOT been tested.
Why dont YOU buy a mutt and prove us all wrong?
Dis connect your nitrous and prove to us that these mutts are the shiznit.
And i will say it again, it has nothing to do with having a set of BALLS! It has to do with me spending a LOT of money on something that has NOT been tested.
Why dont YOU buy a mutt and prove us all wrong?
Dis connect your nitrous and prove to us that these mutts are the shiznit.
<<<What is so different from hand porting and it being done by machine?? Prove to me that hand porting causes loss of power. I dont care how shiny the inside of the exhaust housing is, as soon as its bolted up i cant see it anyway! >>>
Dude, seriously, stop right there before you dig yourself deeper. If you can't see it for yourself, then you are beyond help on this one. Why don't you go take out a die grinder, and bore your cylinders by hand too, or maybe align hone the crank bores or something... If all you think port work is for is to 'look pretty' then...wow...I honestly don't even know how to respond to that. Congratulations, for the first time, NosLaser is speechless.
<<<Why dont YOU buy a mutt and prove us all wrong? >>>
Because I don't care!! Don't you see? To me it's not about which one is better or worse, it's about lack of education and knocking a product for the sake of knocking it. You know why else I don't care? Because no matter WHAT turbo I bolt on the car, I WILL make power on it. Period. I won't sit back and cry the blues about how much a product has been tested. I'll put it on my car, and make POWER with it. There's a phrase I like to use. It goes "improvise, adapt, overcome." At the time, all I could afford was small 16g. So I experimented with nitrous, and made over 400hp to the wheels!! Most people with a 16g would sit back and say "well, I guess I'm limited to 300 wheel HP until I can save up more money to buy a bigger turbo." I'm not God's gift to DSMs. I'm not God's gift to tuning. I simply grabbed my balls, and made power with what I had to work with. I'd hate to see you guys competing on an episode of junkyard wars!! You'd spend all your time watching the other team to wait and see if theirs works first before you even lift a finger. Someone would come up with a good idea, and the rest of you would would stand around arms folded across your chest, noses in the air, in snied voices "prove it first!"
Dude, seriously, stop right there before you dig yourself deeper. If you can't see it for yourself, then you are beyond help on this one. Why don't you go take out a die grinder, and bore your cylinders by hand too, or maybe align hone the crank bores or something...
If all you think port work is for is to 'look pretty' then...wow...I honestly don't even know how to respond to that. Congratulations, for the first time, NosLaser is speechless. <<<Why dont YOU buy a mutt and prove us all wrong? >>>
Because I don't care!! Don't you see? To me it's not about which one is better or worse, it's about lack of education and knocking a product for the sake of knocking it. You know why else I don't care? Because no matter WHAT turbo I bolt on the car, I WILL make power on it. Period. I won't sit back and cry the blues about how much a product has been tested. I'll put it on my car, and make POWER with it. There's a phrase I like to use. It goes "improvise, adapt, overcome." At the time, all I could afford was small 16g. So I experimented with nitrous, and made over 400hp to the wheels!! Most people with a 16g would sit back and say "well, I guess I'm limited to 300 wheel HP until I can save up more money to buy a bigger turbo." I'm not God's gift to DSMs. I'm not God's gift to tuning. I simply grabbed my balls, and made power with what I had to work with. I'd hate to see you guys competing on an episode of junkyard wars!! You'd spend all your time watching the other team to wait and see if theirs works first before you even lift a finger. Someone would come up with a good idea, and the rest of you would would stand around arms folded across your chest, noses in the air, in snied voices "prove it first!"
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